[ OPEN ] i know some places and i've seen some faces

[falcony]

WHO: sam wilson and anyone/everyone.
WHAT: captain america cookout.
WHERE: sam's horizon domain
WHEN: third saturday of september (aka, about 3 weeks after the jailbreak)
NOTES: see below!

HELLO ALL AND WELCOME TO SAM'S CAPTAIN AMERICA COOKOUT!!!!

Over the last week or so, Sam has been going out of his way to contact as many people as he knows to invite them to a cookout at his place in the Horizon. He knows that after the jailbreak, a lot of people were separated, and this was his first thought on how to bring people together. The purpose behind it is simply because Sam thinks that the one thing all of them have in common, opinion on the Singularity and their situations aside, is that they were all brought here and can actually access the Horizon. He sees merit and use in coming together when they can, especially in ways that don't involve the politics of the land they're now living in. So, what better way to do that than around food?

The long and short of it is - this is a peace meal. Leave your issues at the door. Sam has very few rules and there is very little he will give in terms of what this cookout will entail, but three things he will make very clear:

1.) There will be no fighting at his home. You want to duke it out? Take it somewhere else. There will not be warnings or second chances. Don't be an ass.
2.) There is no meeting or serious reason for this cookout. Literally, he just wants people to come together who may no longer be able to see each other due to the travel constraints. It's meant to be fun. Come have fun. (he knows y'all know what that is, even when some of you pretend you don't). Bring food if you want to! There is also a kitchen (if you know what that is) and places to crash. Hope you like seafood!
3.) Anyone who can come into the Horizon is welcome. He'd love it if everyone came, so spread the word.

The cookout itself is set up out front, with picnic tables and chairs and fire pits and lights abound. There are tables set up near grilles if anyone wants to do any actual cooking outside, and a table (probably multiple) set up with sides and napkins and utensils. There are a variety of different places to go and sit and hang out while you're eating. Anything and everything you can want is available - food, drinks, yard games, music playing from out in the trees that will remain consistent unless someone tries to find the speakers and hijack the playlists, etc. If you can't find something outside, you're more than welcome to check the house.

All throughout the party, too, there will be a new friend. Red, as Sam fondly calls him, is a blood-red hunting hawk with silver in between the feathers. He can be found circling around Sam quite often, or perched on his shoulders, but also if you are out and about you can often see him checking up on anyone and everyone. He's a very curious little bird, and also pretty sassy, if you want to interact with him.



If you haven't, or have, been to Sam's domain before, feel free to take a look around. Anywhere is open (save for one locked bedroom) so everyone has open access, but most of the cookout itself will be located in the front yard.

OOC: This is mean to be an OPEN LOG, so leave your TLs or closed threads below! This party will last basically as long as people want it to, but the idea is for it to be an afternoon into the evening. Y'all have free reign save for destroying Sam's home, but if you have any questions, hit me up on plurk (disarmingly or disco (dai#3757). Sam's TL is below, and he will be bouncing around like the good host he is, but lets get a little party started.

Comments

[coerthantorment]

[Estinien simply observes Sam as he pauses and then makes his way over, his arms crossed and his back leaning against the nearest available surface. He's being acknowledged, at least, which is a relief after recent conversations he's had. He even finds Sam's demeanor somehow familiar - a look he's seen many times in a dear friend of his. Someone who knows that they need to compromise and face criticism, who is prepared to face bitter detractors if he has to.

His gut turns, a sudden sadness tugging at his heart. He wonders what Aymeric would say about all of this. He wonders if he would agree with him. He feels like he would, like he'd understand Estinien the way he always had, no matter how angry or sullen he became. But he doesn't actually know and there's no one to tell him. Himeka is too much like him, in the end, to offer that perspective. In that sense, he's alone.

Yet, those pangs of nostalgia can't truly blind him from the issue. He's never been one to hold back from speaking what he considers to be truth, no matter how inconvenient.]

I would ask what side you are you taking, then? [It's a genuine question, even if he's already bracing for the answer he expects.] All that this display communicates is that you consider those needlessly persecuted and those who would uphold that persecution as one and the same. Simply different 'agendas' that you nobly take no part in.

You are not exonerated by your ambivalence. To welcome those that would support Ambrose as friends is to declare Thorne's policies as acceptable. Need I remind you that includes the coldblooded murder of kidnapped children?

[While even Relena hasn't seemed to take it nearly so harshly, he will not soon forget the Queen's lack of remorse for risking the life of a young prisoner who had never so much as raised a hand against her kingdom.]

[falcony]

[ they're not incorrect questions to be asking. whether or not sam wanted to be bombarded with them in the middle of an attempt to bring people together didn't really matter. he knows enough about estinein, whether or not they've actually sat down and officially met, to know that this would be on his mind. that this conversation would happen, and that estinein does, truthfully, deserve some kind of explanation. ]

And what are you going to do if you don't like my answer? [ it's a genuine question in return. because the truth of it is? sam doesn't like ambrose. doesn't agree with how he's doing things. but he equally doesn't agree with attacking people with enough force to kill them when they're frozen and unable to fight back. knowing that estinein is the type of person to do that, no matter how right he might be in his motivations, has definitely given sam a very specific image of the one who stands in front of him.

none of this is black and white, though, and sam knows that. which is why he is holding back judgement. ] Because I'm not taking a side, at least not yet. If that has to change I'm happy to let you know, but right now? I'm pretty sure most of us are just trying to figure out what the hell is even going on. [ because that's the truth of where sam stands right now - he doesn't even know if he trusts what ambrose has said about the singularity. the prime minister either. without an active war, he's not seeing sides to be taking. not yet, at least. ]

And just to be clear- I don't like anything about what Ambrose has done or is doing, or anything that Thorne is doing either, at all. But honestly? I'm not a huge fan that you think those of us who were actually trying to get people out of the dungeon the entire time we've been here as upholding persecution.

[ there's a part of sam who wishes he could say things like and don't talk to be about needless persecution, but he recognizes the second before he says anything that estinein doesn't have the background to understand that, and that sam doesn't really have the place to assume estinein's experience is anything similar to what sam has at home, so. he holds that one back. ]

I don't want to be exonerated by anything. What I do are my own choices, just as yours are yours. But do need I remind you that all of us were brought here against our wills? And how, at the moment, Ambrose is the only person who knows how to send us back? I don't like the guy, and I definitely don't approve of his methods, but knowing he's the only way back doesn't make people wanting to stick close to him a bad idea. And that doesn't really give you the right to judge the people who think that maybe outright opposition to the guy isn't the fastest way home, either.

[ sam specifically exhales, then, pushing that stress out with the breath too. he isn't angry with estinein, and any of his growing frustration isn't at all directed to him, so sam takes a moment to recenter himself. ]

I'm not asking you to agree with them. I honestly don't know what they were thinking by wanting to stick around. Maybe they do agree with him, which would be fucked. But what I meant by this gathering was getting all of us, who are technically in the same boat here together, to have a chance to reconnect. What you do, and what they do, are y'alls own business, but our best bet has been and will continue to be sticking together, if we have any chance of getting out of this place.

[ there is a single pause here, where sam's eyes get hard. ]

And I do not support murder. [ and that look from sam? is directed at estinein this time. potentially referring to estinein's whole platform situation. ] In case that wasn't obvious.

[coerthantorment]

[There's a lot being said here, and Estinien is content to let Sam speak his piece without interruption. After all, he isn't expecting to change Sam's mind. That's not what he's good at, and not what he's here for. He's asking purely because he wants to know where they stand, and maybe to make Sam aware of how this looks, if he truly wasn't aware. What Sam sees as an act of peace feels like an act of war against Estinien's need for justice.

Yet, it can't be said that Sam is wrong - Estinien is the sort of attack a hated enemy when they're helpless, and also the sort to kill those he considers aggressors with little provocation. Ambrose is a threat he can only see becoming worse with time, and if he could snuff out that power before more were harmed, he would consider it an uncomplicated victory.

Especially because he knows something that apparently Sam does not.]

No one knows how to send us back. Not Ambrose, not his King and Queen, and not his gaggle of mages. Ambrose's own sister told me as much. For the known history of Abraxas, they have never successfully sent someone from this realm to another.

[He scoffs.]

So am I to spare this beast based on knowledge he doesn't have, but may theoretically, by unlikely chance, develop in the future? I think not.

[As for the idea that murder is just bad in a universal sense, that nothing would justify executing Ambrose, he won't even consider it. He's seen the necessity for such actions time and time again - even at Himeka's hand, whom he considers much more understanding than he is.]

[falcony]

[ there is a lot being said here, and sam is appreciative that estinein at least appears to be willing to listen. and that they can have this discussion, without any outward aggression being taken. because sam has opened this space for it, has made this talk something that they can have and that he has a part in, at least for now. but sam reminds himself, even now, of the rest of the people here. what estinein did and the people he fought against, other people brought here. sam is not willing to have a second go at what happened at the platform, and he's glad he's got a few others here watching out for this same thing.

but if needed, he'll make it clear to estinein, again, that he's not willing to let this kind of talk keep going beyond just them. if he wants to discuss politics and this situation at large, they can open up another board meeting in another place at another time. this is just supposed to be a reminder that they are not each other's enemies. not outright. not unless they choose to be - and if that is the case, they can choose do it somewhere else.

but that little piece of information - that is interesting, and sam crosses his arms over his chest as he considers it. so they can't send them back? or they just haven't yet? he knows that ambrose's sister and him did not have a great track record, but did that mean any information coming out of her was valid? ]

Did his sister say anything about if they've successfully brought people here before us? The Prime Minister of the Free Cities says she doesn't know of it ever working before.

[ the scoff does very little to shift sam's expression. if anything, he remains neutral almost in spite of it. ]

Listen- we can get into the morality around sparing that beast and how everything you're saying sounds an awful lot like what you're damning him for, if you want to. [ sam supposes he could wait and see if that was estinein's intention, knows that there hasn't been anything about this interaction that will lead him to think otherwise, but something in him needs this to be understood and out in the open. ] But before we get down that road, I'm going to need you to realize that this ends here, between you and me. [ he gestures a finger between them. ] Whenever either of us get tired or move on, you're not going to bring it up with anyone else at this party. I was serious when I said no fighting, and if you're only here to try and talk about your grand plans to murder a hugely important political figure, you're going to need to do it somewhere else.

[ there isn't exactly anger in sam's voice, but there is a kind of seriousness that slips into the words. a weight, a promise. and then sam takes a breath, as if reminding himself of where they are, and some of that tension eases out of him. ]

I was serious when I welcomed you here, and I'm down to keep talking all you want. But I need to know you understand that first. [ he is quite serious about waiting for estinein to confirm that much before he continues. ] Okay?

[coerthantorment]

[Truthfully, he hadn't been intending to bring it up with anyone else, the orchestrator of this even being his primary concern. Of course, what Sam says to him immediately before asking him to avoid doing just that sends a jolt of fury through his gut, and creates the tantalizing urge to disregard the man's requests entirely.

...how everything you're saying sounds an awful lot like what you're damning him for...

He's not even sure he understands it, at first, the words sticking in his head even as Sam has continued on. Is Sam trying to say that imprisoning and harming dozens without reasonable cause and seeking retribution for that injustice are the same thing? That he is somehow the same as Ambrose for taking vengeance for a crime already committed, while Ambrose punished so many for no crime at all? If that's not what Sam is getting at, he wishes he knew what was, because now he finds himself gritting his fangs, with anything but cooperation on his mind.]

Do you always offer such condescending barbs mere moments before asking for peace?

[He's prepared himself to hear out Sam's thoughts, only to be met with what he considers to be a dismissive false equivocation. Followed up by being scolded like a child for having the audacity to bring anything but blind whimsy into his presence. Thankfully, even with this anger, he's had a lot of practice keeping his stance and expression level despite it. Though the look he gives that remark is far from fond there's still no evidence of him taking physical action as a result.]

You are the only one I'm concerned with right now. No one here decided upon this stance but you, and I am fully aware that voicing such undesireable thoughts while others attempt their merrymaking would be a lost cause.

[As for Sam's question about the summonings, he does have an answer to that, but he's also set on having this part addressed before going into anything else.]

[falcony]

[ alright, so it is entirely possible that sam went a little far with his comment. he'll admit that, to himself and even to estinein when they get there, because he can see the way that estinein reacts and can feel the tension rising between them. this hadn't been what he came over here to do. which is why, at the question estinein poses, sam does feel himself sigh. to estinein's credit, he does also agree to sam's conditions, that he's not going to be heading out into the rest of the party or to the others involved, and with that reassurance, sam feels a bit more like he can continue the conversation at hand. ]

Okay, you're right. [ he uncrosses his arms, holding his hands out a bit in apology, without really saying as much. not entirely, at least. he specifically tries to make his body language mirror the tone at which he continues speaking, unassuming and intentionally neutral. because even sam could notice when his own tone was getting a little harsh. ]

I'm not trying to be condescending, and I know that we're coming at this from very different views. The truth is- I really don't think you're wrong to want to get back at Thorne. They are especially dangerous, knowing what they're willing to do just to learn more about the Singularity.

[ because while this conversation may or may not have been heading in one direction, the reality is that sam doesn't really disagree with a lot of what estinein is saying. it's just the what to do about it that they're not aligned. ]

I'm sorry if I came off too strong there.

[coerthantorment]

[It's easy to tell that Estinien is an intense individual, but thankfully, while he is inclined towards anger, he's also capable of adapting to new circumstances. Instead of letting his fury drive him off a cliff in this conversation, he remains attentive as Sam seems to rethink his words. As Sam concedes some ground, and even apologizes, some of Estinien's tension bleeds away.

Not all of it, because this is an emotional topic for him, and even with his discipline he's unwilling to pretend it's not. But he can at least gather that Sam isn't trying to dismiss or demean him. If the man were to make a habit of slipping in such comments he'd be less tolerant, but as it is, he can accept Sam trying to set things on a different course.

Because Estinien isn't here just to be angry and break things, he tries to remind himself. He wanted an explanation for the man's actions. For better or for worse, he's getting one. There's a bit of a delay before Estinien seems to decide how respond, but when he does, it's with a more level tone.]

... So... your thought is that those staying with Thorne may be doing so for the sake of information and influence rather than enthusiasm or acceptance of their methods?

[It's a bit of an awkward attempt to restart the conversation on his part, and Sam might notice the wheels turning in Estinien's head as he works on a way to approach this. Like a man who is very unaccustomed to holding his tongue putting extra effort into choosing his words.]

... I have found myself unwilling to give them the benefit of the doubt in that way. Not all of them were as gracious as you were while living in the castle as guests. I find it difficult to imagine they are all that concerned with the consequences of Thorne's actions.

[Maybe it's some kind of long game they are playing, and simply performing the role admirably. The trouble is, Estinien is not one to search for reasons to see the best in people. By his thinking, this is a situation where those remaining in Thorne are guilty until proven innocent.]

Are you not concerned that, by allowing them access to gathering such as this, that you are providing information to a nation who sees us as fugitives and has already proven they would have few qualms putting us to death?

[This time, less than making accusations to satisfy his own frustration, Estinien is trying to more genuinely find out if this is something Sam has considered.]

[falcony]

[ and that's the thing - sam can tell estinein is an intense individual. and he's kind of kicking himself for allowing that intensity to rub him the wrong way. it makes sense why estinein is upset, makes sense that he would be angered by sam's choices here. it's been a while since he's been in this situation, he realizes - some years since his last counseling session, save for his conversation with karli, which hadn't been official by any means.

sam reminds himself that he set the boundary of no fighting, and that he opened up the communication with estinein. he needs to listen, and listen more openly. he has his own opinions on the matter, yes, but that doesn't make estinein's incorrect in any way. and he can recognize that estinein is doing much of the same - trying to step back, to go about this conversation in a calmer way. he very obviously feels passionate about this, and sam wants to respect that. respect him. ]

My thoughts are that everyone has a different reason for going where they wanted to go, or staying where they were. It could be information, it could be for influence - hell. It could be that they just missed the portals because they were too busy helping everyone else. [ there is a slight tension that runs through sam, at that point. he's thinking about bucky being left behind, about how he still - somehow - feels guilty about it. but that's not what estinein is trying to talk about, so sam continues. ] But I can't speak for everyone, and I don't want to try. Not everyone is going to see it the way you, or I, see it. And maybe there are some who do just totally agree with Ambrose and all Thorne's shit- it's all possible. I'm not here to force you to see it my way, or their way. That's not the point to all this.

[ sam doesn't really want to go into his philosophy on people - that he does, to this day, believe they are inherently good. that it's situational things that push them in one direction or the other. he knows it's a bit naive, and he knows there have been and will always be moments where that will come and bite him in the ass. but for now... for now, he doesn't see the intelligent people he's met so far blindly following a dude like ambrose.

he can always be corrected, but he's not there yet. ]

As for whether or not I'm worried about spies- I guess that would depend on what information you consider valuable. Any and all people that are here are here of their own accord. They don't have to tell the ones who stayed in Thorne where they went, or where they're staying. They don't have to talk to them at all, if they don't want to. That means, at least from my perspective, the only information they could get here would be the same they could get coming into the Horizon at any other time. [ the short answer is yes, sam absolutely considered this. spent hours upon hours going over it in his head to make sure that this would be safe. or that he could make it as safe as possible. ] If someone who was staying in Thorne really wanted to get information on - for the sake of argument, let's say you or me - they wouldn't get any more information here, at this party, than they would if they just showed up in our domain, would they? [ sam's question is genuine - if estinein is seeing something he isn't, he is absolutely willing to listen and adjust. the safety for everyone is, and continues to be, his top priority. ]

If anything, I had hoped that this whole event would remind everyone that we're all in this together. That the people who left Thorne did it for a reason, just as the people who stayed in the castle did. It's really easy to vilify people you don't have to see or interact with, and even easier to forget that we're all just people, in the end. The nation can't come into the Horizon, only we can. And there's power if we can remind each other that we're more alike than different, no matter where we ended up.

[ and that's the heart of it, isn't it? sam trying to remind them all that for all the places they go, and for all the natives they're around, anyone coming into the horizon are in this together. that thorne needs them more than they need thorne. there's power in that, and sam wants everyone to remember that.

but then, once he's said his piece, sam's expression grows a bit thoughtful. ]

Can I ask you something?

[coerthantorment]

[Estinien glances to the floor at their side, not entirely certain how to react. Sam doesn't sound completely wrong. He has seen the importance of finding peace between quarrelling parties, to remind everyone that their needs and wants are ultimately the same. With the beast tribes, with the dragons... there were treaties to be made, and peace to earn.

What he doesn't feel at ease with is assuming that peace without investigating the motivations of those involved. Not only are the people from Thorne welcome right off the bat, it is being actively discouraged to question their choices, or to discuss these factors at all. This party isn't for problem-solving, it's for forgetting about your woes and for attempting to develop a sense of comradery while showing very little of your true self.

It makes it too easy for him to feel comfortable with. Too easy for someone to deceive, to manipulate, gain people's trust without having themselves tested at all. Estinien is beginning to begrudgingly accept Sam's point, the base concepts being something he can understand, but in practice he can't see those that still lurk at Ambrose's side as anything but threatening extensions of the kingdom that hurt him, and possibly doomed his entire home in the process.

Fear is the thing he's feeling, even if he doesn't want to think about it like that. Fear, and anger enough to feel like it's something he has control over. Anger is active after all, vengeance is something you can take. What can you do about fear, besides pushing it down, casting it aside if you can? Nothing.]

The Horizon... its powers allow us unknowable capabilities. It could be that they simply eavesdrop, listening in on words not meant for them, or use some trick of the mind on those that are unsuspecting. An event like this is intended to make one drop their guard - is it not? To 'relax'?

[With such a festive atmosphere, with food and drink being served, he doesn't trust people to be properly on guard around their potential enemies. People like Kay, like Himeka even... their eagerness to make friends could be their downfall, especially if they've already been plied with comfort and drink.

It's clear, at least, that relaxing in this context is impossible for Estinien. Not with those people here. The threat they pose lurks indelibly in his mind.

And then, there's Sam's question. Estinien finally looks back at him, his brow furrowed as if he's not all that certain about where this is going.]

What?

[falcony]

[ sam waits, patient and unpressured, as estinein seems to consider his words. it's what he's wanted, out of this. estinein has come to him and asked him to explain, and that is what sam is doing - explaining his point of view, explaining his reasoning, hoping, if the moment calls for it, to be corrected if he's off. because at the heart of all of this, there will always be sam, making the best decision he can, and wondering for ages afterward if it had been right at all. because he has his intent, and he has his plans, and he has his backup and his defenses and everything he can think to do to bring everyone together, but there is always the chance for something to go wrong.

that's why everyone is here. that's why sam wants everyone together. if estinein has a view on this that sam isn't thinking about, he wants to have his eyes opened to it. and if he can open estinein's eyes, if only just a little bit, isn't it worth it?

he's worked with enough individuals to know that aggression and anger tend to stem from something else, and that more often than not that 'something else' was either shame, or fear, or desperation. or even a combination of those three, and more. he watches estinein consider the words and watches estinein mull over his reaction and when he does finally ask, sam nods. ]

Sure. [ sam nods, even glances over his shoulder to the rest of the party. back to the house, and beyond. ] They could be. But the way I see it- they could be eavesdropping with that same magic in anyone's domain at any point, right? At least for right now, they're in mine, and I can keep an eye on them. This is my home, and if anything starts happening... [ there's a feeling here that sam is suddenly a lot more aware of everything going on in this domain than he's let on to be, but even that's a question. if it's the magic, or just sam, in control. confident in what he's doing. ] And yeah- the idea is for people to relax, but it's also for people to see each other. To eat together, talk. You'd be surprised what you can find out about people over a shared meal.

[ he understands being protective, and he certainly understands wanting to keep those who may be too trusting away from perceived threats. it's just a matter of how much of a threat those who are here really are. and that is where they disagree, but sam's not entirely looking to try and change estinein's entire outlook. not yet, maybe not even tonight.

instead, sam's attention turns back to estinein, his gaze...well. it's not intense, but it's curious. even. estinein looks at him with a furrowed brow and sam watchs him for a moment longer before answering. ]

You're a soldier, right? Did you fight a war back home?

[coerthantorment]

[He can't claim to find Sam's answer very satisfying, given that Thorne's people finding out more information than they should is half of his concern. He's feeling increasingly isolated in this regard, increasingly convinced that he won't be able to change anyone's mind. No one seems worried but him, after all. Not even those he considers his friends.

He shifts restlessly, not all that sure what else he can say. He'll just leave after this, he thinks. He's not suited to this sort of environment, and the idea of being here much longer feels increasingly miserable.

Sam's question draws back his attention, however, though he's not sure if it's in a way he likes. He narrows his eyes.]

What gives you that impression?

[Sam is completely right in his guess, but it feels... presumptuous, somehow. He'd at least like to know what part of him is giving off that impression - even though he knows full well it could be a great many things.]

[falcony]

[ sam is getting the feeling that estinein doesn't exactly agree with him, that he doesn't really like the explanation that sam gives, but it's all he can do at the moment. sam doesn't want to convince anyone of the factions, around here. he's got his own issues with thorne, his own issues with the free cities too, but that's not their war. and, sam reminds himself again, it's going to feel different for those who started off in the dungeons too. the anger, the distrust - he can be sympathetic, he knows what it feels to be caged and held, but sympathy only goes so far.

he's doing what he can, but it's not going to be enough for everyone, and sam has to remember there's nothing inherently wrong about that.

estinein's narrowed eyes gets sam to lift his hands, in as much of a hear me out sort of way as it is defensive. when his hands drop, its to his sides. ]

Sorry- I am, or was, a soldier back home. [ sam shrugs, though as it always tends to happen when he thinks of home, there's a hint of something darker across his face. a mark that never goes away. ] And I used to counsel soldiers, too. I got the feeling while we were talking, but I didn't want to assume anything if I was wrong.

[ sam seems to be explicitly waiting for estinein to say yes or no before he continues. ]

[coerthantorment]

Counsel...

[Estinien murmurs the word, knowing what it means in a dictionary sense, but having less of an instinctive knowledge of what Sam intends. Mental health was not really a concern in his country - or even if it was a concern, it was not something anyone was all that prepared to do something about. Really, Estinien isn't even knowledgeable enough about it to know that receiving help for these problems was ever something he should want or need.

Everyone went to war. Whatever scars you came away with were just part of the deal, same as lost limbs or dead comrades. It's just something you had to live with. He doesn't know what Sam is talking about, and assumes he means that he more generally gave them... advice, maybe.]

I was. [He isn't going to hide it. He shrugs his shoulders.] From as early as they would take me. [And even before that, in the form of private training.]

[falcony]

[ sam could, he supposes, explain what he means by that. it may or may not be a modern word (and 'modern' is really the only way sam has been able to box up the differences in his experiences and others), but the connotation probably is. mental health, and the support of mental health... anyway. he could get heated, if he wanted to, but that isn't the point he's trying to make and he's going to take a guess that estinein doesn't really want to have that conversation either.

so sam nods, both in a sort of push for himself, but also in agreement. as early as they would take me. there's a hint of a smile tugging at sam's mouth, at that. ] Me too. Probably earlier than I had any right to, but the second I could enlist, I was there.

[ there's a lot more, to all of this. about growing up in lousiana, about wanting to fight the world. what drove him to enlist and what kept him away, even while his whole life was slowly unraveling back home. sam watches a speedrun of his years, from eighteen to forty, play out in a matter of seconds. about how the kid he had been would never, not in his wildest dreams, have imagined he would be here. (not that his forty-year-old self is really convinced he's here, either, but again - a point for another time.)

estinein shrugs, and sam continues - because he feels like there might be a moment, worth all of this, in here. a chance for estinein to listen, yes, but also maybe feel a bit more heard. we're not all that different he wants to simply say, but sam knows these things are never - really - that simple. ]

Are you still one? Back home? [ because that 'was' can mean a couple of things, and sam is curious. ]

[coerthantorment]

[Estinien wonders if Sam had similar reasons for wanting to enlist so eagerly. It's hard to imagine what conflicts might be happening on these foreign words, or if he'd even be able to understand the culture surrounding them. Then again, as many thing feel the same as they do different.

He doesn't really know how to answer Sam at first, because knowing what to think of himself as has been a major point of contention for some time now. He retired, officially speaking, but has that really made any difference? Is it possible for him to see the world in another way at this point?]

I suppose I am. If you can be a soldier while serving no particular nation. [Of course his heart would always lay with Ishgard, but he hasn't purely kept himself to missions involving his homeland. At this stage of the conflict, everything is hopelessly tangled together, anyway.]

When the war in my homeland ended, I laid down mine official titles, but not long after I was drafted to aid an organization called the Scions. Less a military, and more an organization tasked with solving everyone's problems, regardless of nation.

[He says that dryly, as if suggesting that he finds such an endeavor somewhat funny in how masochistic it is.]

I've never known a time that there wasn't a war to fight. 'Tis the same work, when it comes down to it.

[falcony]

[ now that is interesting. sam shifts the barest amount where he's standing, as if something that estinein had just said had changed the direction of this conversation. it's not a bad thing, if anything, sam feels suddenly more equipped. he's been here before, with more people than he cares to count. what's a soldier without a war?

he thinks of steve, coming to find him at the va. he thinks about bucky, slipping so easily into the winter soldier. he thinks of the faces and the people and the names of everyone who came up to him after his meetings. some with smiles, others not. estinein answers him and sam lifts a single shoulder - a half shrug, if that's even really a thing. ]

Do you want to be? A soldier, I mean. [ there is something both sad, but entirely too relatable, to the way estinien says i've never known a time that there wasn't a war to fight. sam feels himself smiling a bit at it, at how incredible that no matter how different their places, their situations, their lives - it's all still somehow exactly the same. and estinien's dry tone does pull a sort of smile from sam, because yeah, that's...he gets it. ]

Believe it or not, I'm in kind of the exact same boat. Was a soldier, but came back home and ended up sort of volunteering for another group who were...less an army and more like a group of talented people, all trying to protect the world. [ sam considers this, rubbing at his chin, before he tilts a hand back in forth. ] So maybe not the exact same, but I can see what you're saying. There's always going to be something to do, a fight to join, that kind of thing.

[ sam wonders if that is what estinien is most upset about - the fact he'd been caged, the fact he'd been drafted to do a job he didn't ask for, the fact there were others willing to let slide something that so wholly was not acceptable to him. again, he's reminded of steve, in another weird, roundabout way. ]

What sort of thing do you do in the Scions?

[coerthantorment]

[It does all sound like very much the same sort of business, and while that doesn't surprise Estinien, it does make him wonder. What differences are there that cause Sam to see the world so differently, given their supposedly similar experiences? Maybe's Sam's intentions were simply more noble from the start, or maybe he actively cultivated this sort of personality instead of singlemindedly throwing himself towards vengeance.

He guesses it doesn't need to be more than that. Estinien really did do this to himself, he understands.]

I'm not sure 'want' has much to do with it.

[Not at this point, anyway. Estinien had thought his battle might be over for only a short time, before Hraesvelgr himself reminded him of the absurdity of that thought. He's spent some time on his own pursuits, of course, wandering here and there, experiencing things just for the sake of it... but ultimately it all leads back to the same thing. It was a vacation, not a change.]

While Himeka and the rest were waylaid by other concerns, their secretary hunted me down to address... I suppose, the issue of some kind of biological weapon. Ostensibly destined to wipe out most life on the continent. And so, 'twas left to me to destroy its production lines, and what quantities had already been accrued.

[He shrugs his shoulders. Ultimately he was not actually mad about being bothered into doing this, given the incredibly severe stakes. It really did speak to the way that history was just one disaster after another, though.]

Beyond that... I had only just recently decided to join their ranks in an official capacity. [Though he doesn't actually say it, his expression softens a bit - at the time he'd given a big sappy speech about the decision, and about how the whole organization had given him reason to hope. And yet...] Only to be snatched away before much else could be done.

Our entire world is facing its end of days... I had hoped to fight alongside them, but instead, Thorne thought my time would be better spent rotting in a cage.

[There's another flash of anger as he says it. It's not just about being caged and not just about being drafted. It's being taken away from the one thing he'd ever felt hope about, only to have it ripped away from him, and his entire world being potentially left to its doom as a result.]

[falcony]

[ that's the heart of it, isn't it? that so many people can come from so many similar experiences and still end up in completely different places. can think completely different things. sam is used to it, by now - used to expecting and used to seeing and used to assuming that everyone he meets is going to think something else, so he has to be able to take all of those things and adapt.

but vengeance. man, that's a hell of a drug. and sam knows what it can be like, when you have a taste. ]

Man, I'm pretty sure 'want' has everything to do with it, here.

[ because sure, it's hard to leave that world behind when you're not in it anymore. harder, still, to find what it means to be yourself when you've devoted so much of yourself to it. sam's spent years pulling others through the thick of 'what does it mean to be a soldier without a war', so much that something about this back an forth almost feels familiar. comforting, in a way.

but when estinien explains a little further, sam seems to get it, relaxing a bit with his posture, his understanding. ah, it seems to say. so you weren't really given the chance to find out. ]

So you were fighting for the good of your world? [ a beat, and then sam seems to realize how vague the question is. ] I mean- end of days. Was someone trying to destroy it?

[ because the truth is - sure, sam has a point he may or may not be working towards, but he definitely finds himself curious about estinien. about where he started, where that's left him. what it means that he's here, now, doing what he's doing. reacting, the way he reacts. every piece of the puzzle creates a bigger picture, and while sam isn't any kind of puzzle-master, he knows that to really help someone, you've got to understand where they're coming from. ]

[coerthantorment]

[He shakes his head a little. Estinien isn't sure what difference being here makes. It's not as if him being this way is an external factor he can be free of - not when he arrived in this place only to be pulled along into another potentially world-ending disaster. He feels like he'll have to keep fighting as long as a battle needs to be fought.

How could he just leave it be in good conscience? He was made for this after all, and if he doesn't do it, someone else will have to anyway. Just as it always goes.]

Aye. They have been for some time, feeling our destruction was necessary for their own salvation, but now their ambitions seem to have devolved into simply wishing for the end of all life. Using foul magicks to enslave entire nations, summoning corrupted gods, and sewing the seeds of chaos at every turn.

[He looks downward, keeping himself steady. He feels anxious just thinking about it. What has happened in his absence? Has time passed? If so, are they already too late?]</small. 'Tis why I swore my lance to Himeka and the Scions. There would never be a greater need.

[falcony]

[ well, that would be that, isn't it? that, in a way, estinien does want to hold onto the mantle, if only because someone will have to. sam is curious if that streak runs deeper, if there's more to that, if estinien would take the opportunity to be something else, when given it. sam knows he didn't, and wouldn't if asked again. but when you're talking about obligation versus volunteering, that gets into some muddy water.

being made for something, too, is an entirely different conversation.

but then there's that - because estinien explains, about destruction for the sake of salvation, about ending all life. it's intense stuff, yes, sam understands that. feels that, deep in his bones. but what he catches onto more than that is the unsteadiness that estinien suddenly gives off. it makes sam want to reach out to steady him, to set a hand on his shoulder just to ground him, but given the rockiness and elevation changes of their currently conversation, he's not sure it's the right move.

still, when sam speaks, it's with a kind of empathetic concern. a sudden, perhaps intense, leveling of his eyes to estinien when he looks back up. ] You okay? [ and he's genuinely asking, genuinely worried. moments later, with whatever answer estinien gives, sam will just nod. ]

Listen, I don't know the details of your life, or your world, or the Scions. But I'm glad they have you there, to help. And once we figure out a way to get everyone back home, there will be a way to get you back to where you need to be. [ because there is always, and will always be, dr strange. right? sam doesn't elaborate on how, or why, just says that with conviction that would be hard for anyone to question. ] You and Himeka. [ he glances up, briefly. back to the house. seems to lighten, briefly, at the glance. ] If I can convince her to leave the kitchen...

[coerthantorment]

[Estinien glances to the side, though he snorts when Sam mentions Himeka being in the kitchen. Himeka is more adaptable than him, he thinks. She can enjoy himself with the opportunity presents itself - a concept which feels far away from him at the moment.]

If that the High Mage has said is true... then returning home may do little good, without first resolving affairs here.

[As much as he hates having been called here at such a terrible time, what good would it do to return and solve the problems at home, only to have the multiverse be torn apart by the actions of those who remain in Abraxas? He wishes he could know for certain that it's worth it.]

If Himeka and I are truly the only Scions present... 'twould fall to us to protect the others from the threats they cannot reach.

[That's the thing, ultimately. Estinien can't let go, not like this. He can't just decide it's not his business, that there are no good options, that there's nothing worth fighting for. He has to make a choice, to make a difference, on behalf of his allies that can't.

Remaining idle seems like it would be the greatest betrayal of all.]